Novell News
The City of Los Angeles
October 29th, 2009 by Ian Bruce
This week the Los Angeles city council voted to move forward with a proposal to replace the City's existing e-mail and productivity solutions with cloud-based e-mail, calendaring and document services from Google.
Like the LA Police department and others, we continue to doubt the economics and security of the City's decision to move to a Google system. The City Council was presented with clear evidence that Google posed a very significant risk to the security of City and citizen data, much of it highly confidential. In addition, independent financial data showed that the new system will actually cost more, not less.
With the City facing a massive budget deficit, the speculated budget benefits of switching to this untested application are enticing, but as a recent independent Los Angeles City Administrative Officer report has stated, the proposed system under consideration will actually cost taxpayers an additional $1.5 million in the first year. There are significant costs to migrating, training and securing Google Apps.
To set the record straight, Novell GroupWise is a world-class product with more than 30 million users in 120 countries around the globe. Over 1,200 US agencies use the product, including 47 of the 50 US states. It is a secure, trusted and proven e-mail and collaboration solution. The latest version of GroupWise 8 includes interactive Web 2.0 dashboards, rich e-mail functionality and robust calendar management capabilities all delivered securely.
The City of Los Angeles should have opted for this proven product to ensure the security of its data and to save taxpayer money. They have taken a risk with no reward. However, as a valued customer, Novell will continue to offer our world-class support to the City of Los Angeles during the transition.
October 29th, 2009 at 12:31 pm
This wasn't technical, it was political.
I've seen it way too many times: Some hotshot new PHB shows up and tears the living crap out of everything, just to make themselves look "valuable." Not once do they ever look around and say "This place runs great; I think I'll just leave well-enough alone."
October 29th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
Ian,
Thanks for your comments. As a consultant in the industry, I cannot tell you (nor do I have to I'm sure) how many times I have seen this. It is difficult to show apples/apples comparisons to products like GroupWise 5.5 and Exchange 2007, for example. Yet, I have had customers make such a move, and pat themselves on the back for bringing their email system into the 21st century. It's a shame that the City of Los Angeles did not bring their GroupWise system in line to be able to truly compare it to what they would receive with Google Apps.
I'm happy to support GroupWise, and will be watching the migration of The City of Los Angeles with great interest.
Danita Zanre
Caledonia
October 29th, 2009 at 9:53 pm
The grass is always greener and politicians have very short attention spans for technical details.
That being said the city isn't in the IT business, it's in the business of providing services to it's citizens. Like every other business it needs to focus on it's core competencies. No business wants to be in the IT services industry and if many have the opportunity to relinquish responsibility for something as important, as visible and as complex as a large email system then they will.
October 30th, 2009 at 11:53 am
It's not about which is the better product, it's about which is more widely supported. Market share again. Why is Google getting rave? Market Share and support.
October 30th, 2009 at 3:12 pm
wow… way to make your customer feel "valued". this is why people are leaving novell left and right.
October 30th, 2009 at 4:23 pm
@Rob
You speak of core competencies – that has been like a stick in the eye for most full vision business supporting professionals for some time.
How many Fortune 1000 companies have Accounting & Finance as a core competency? How many of the rest outsource their Accounting & Finance? The question of in-source out-source has nothing to do with core competencies and everything to do with VP and CxO level persons not knowing how to valuate their IT services and thus opting for out-sourced solutions that deliver that precise balance sheet number.
If, as a business person, you take a step back and look at the value IT delivers to your company you would be hard pressed to stand by any claim of "not our core competency". The agility required to grow and flex a business in demanding economic times makes it more important to directly control your IT infrastructure. Losing weeks or months of time while you renegotiate a contract or at least weeks to add services through channels, is time lost where you could have been leveraging the new business opportunity.
In this manner, I believe it is the business itself that is failing to understand business. The exact claim that is made too often of IT.
October 30th, 2009 at 9:07 pm
Maybe it was they didn't want to pay Microsoft more money for Office on top of it, also allows them to use none Microsoft clients much more easily (no need for the Windows 7 upgrade). It is a new way of doing business – instead of attacking it, maybe look to join it and make it better. Need I bring up IPX.
As for GroupWise, time to move into the 21st century and work towards a cloud environment that folks can buy what they want, as Exchange has that future.
As for spending more with Google… err… I would think not in the long run and the integration it provides is awesome. No, I am not a Google Fan Boy.. but a realist.
It hurts to loose – but learn from it.
Keith Neilson
October 30th, 2009 at 11:25 pm
Obviously, Novell is going to be biased for the move OFF of Novell and onto a competitor (Google).
Novell states cost in training. Really. Does it cost anything to show someone how to use web based email? It is common and everyday activity stuff. And if LA staff can not use a web browser, I would be afraid to have them as my government!
October 31st, 2009 at 3:02 am
I think the City of LA made a smart decision. I have been using Google Apps since its inception, and have migrated a few mail systems to it. I think it is a wonderful product, with an excellent set of features and an very reasonable cost per user. I hope Google continues to improve this wonderful product.
October 31st, 2009 at 8:00 am
[...] the PR blog post is very real. And while Novell may (and probably does) have a valid point, how many customers do you think would [...]
October 31st, 2009 at 9:03 am
[...] with a $7.25 million, five-year deal to adopt Gmail, Google Calendar and other applications, Novell's blog has an interesting rebuttal. Of course, the reason for the city's switch to Google's corner of the cloud is to save [...]
October 31st, 2009 at 9:30 am
[...] the PR blog post is very real. And while Novell may (and probably does) have a valid point, how many customers do you think would [...]
October 31st, 2009 at 12:53 pm
Being an administrator of your sofware for years. I can understand fully why this happens.
October 31st, 2009 at 10:30 pm
So it comes to this — Novell publicly criticizes their customer who has paid millions in license and maintenance fees over the years.
I'll remember how Novell treats their customers when my clients select new messaging and collaboration solutions.
November 1st, 2009 at 8:55 am
I wonder if this can be stopped at all.
If the mind of MGMT is set to change to another file/print/email-system, there is only little – only someone with more power – to stop it.
I agree that the lack of keeping the GW system up to date helps here a lot. It simply means MGMT can say they're working with an out of date product.
And hey, it's cool to say you start something new, even if the budget for it isn't there…
In my opininon an end-user board, a group of users – secretaries, MGMT, helpdesk, other users – can be a good thing to make democratic decisions and to come up with advices concerning the USE of IT. In that case an email policy can be used. This gives users the feeling they are part of the process.
Gert
GWCheck.com
November 1st, 2009 at 1:31 pm
I have to agree that IT decisions are rarely factually sound and logical. They tend to be trendy, based on a lame brained article in CIO magazine, personal whim, or all of the above. When I look at Google's offering, I see a huge security risk, a huge liability risk, and hidden costs that can eat up a budget.
It sounds appealing to government and to schools on tight budgets. Free. Free. Free. However, one lawsuit will wipe out any of that savings and they will find that Google disavows any responsibility or liability for their services. They are big enough to fight the city in court and win.
I think the police department would be wise to resist the city on this and keep their systems separate. They have much to lose going to Google.
November 2nd, 2009 at 5:05 am
[...] aller berechtigten Kritik an dem Umstieg, klingt es doch etwas seltsam, wenn solche Worte aus dem Blog des ausgestochenen Konkurrenten [...]
November 2nd, 2009 at 7:25 am
I agree that the move by the City of Los Angeles is rather shortsighted and does not make good technology sense. However, this blog entry has not helped Novell's case and in fact has created quite a stir online–all of which is negative. The move by the City created enough bad PR for Novell on its own without Novell creating any more bad PR.
Novell should really issue a retraction or at least a clarification and try to limit the damage.
Examples:
http://swordandthescript.blogspot.com/2009/10/pr-getting-slammed-for-taking-stand.html
http://boycottnovell.com/2009/10/31/groupwise-rejected-by-la/
http://ostatic.com/blog/novells-blog-wheels-out-tired-criticisms-of-open-source
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/181119/novell_to_los_angeles_drop_dead.html
I'm sure this isn't what Novell intended with this blog posting but alas this is the result in today's Web 2.0 world.
Joe Marton
November 2nd, 2009 at 7:34 am
Novell are always feeling sorry for themselves (I am however a big user of Novell software and a fan of the company). Novell must start to realise that many people prefer the Outlook or Google Apps interface that users see. Novell must improve the GroupWise interface and, inmy opinion, have a stable and good way to allow Microsoft Outlook to access (with the use of all features!) the GroupWise back end. The GroupWise connector was rubbish. This would give companies a great solution – the stable and virus free backend with the world's most popular email client.